Cloudy water

[Rainbowlightning]

Dear all,
I am having a bit of an issue with my 'almost' cycled tank.
Let's see, I'll start from the begining...
I have a 5 gallon tank with heater, thermometer, small corner filter (clear free), gravel, 2 silk plants and small house.
I was given a betta before the tank was able to fully cycle and as you can imagine, he's suffered. Poor guy seems to have burns on his fins. I truley doubt it's fin rot because he has a few loose strands and curly fat tips that have been this way now for about 10 days.

So through recommendation, I now have my betta (since yesterday) in a 1.66g 'hosptal' tank until my 5g tank is fully cycled.

Ok, my tank has been cycling for about 5-6 weeks. It's gone through the ammonia spike and is now going through the nitrate/nitrite spike.
I do 10% water changes every other day (shall start doing them every day from today) and a 25% water change and vacuum once a week.
Here are my parameters (today's):
Ammonia: 0
Nitrate: 20
Nitrite: 5.0
Hardness: 150 (ish)
Alkalinity: 120
PH: varies between 7.2 - 7.8 (today 7.8)

I treat the tank with aquarium salt, water conditioner and once a week I use a product named 'Cycle'.

Today, after taking Mr Fish out (yesterday) the water is extremely cloudy. It's a greyish color. I did a 25% water change yesterday with vacuum.
Is this anything to worry about?
I put 2-3 betta pellets in this tank twice a day, should I still remove them after a while?
Any help on trying to get this tank stable for my betta would be truely appreciated.

[twoluvcats]

now that you don't have a fish in there, slow down your water changes...water changes actually prolong the cycle.

Cloudy water is pretty normal for a cycling tank...there are bacterial blooms and alge blooms that happen. Just keep the tank out of direct sunlight to keep the algae from growing with reckless abandon. And once your tank is cycled, you can replace all of the water, and as long as you don't replace the filter pad, your tank will stay cycled. Your filter media is where most of your good bacteria (that you build up in the cycle) live...so make sure you don't remove your filter again until the tank is cycled.


Keep testing your water, but don't do another water change until your nitrates read closer to 50ppm...keep adding the pellets, leave them in until the nitrates rise, then suck them out with the water change. Toss some fish poo in there too if you can get it.

I would stop the aquarium salt, you don't really need it as an "everyday" thing... Keep using Cycle...some people don't think it works, but I do...think of it as a "bacteria food"

[twoluvcats]

I just read your other post about the type of filter you have, and starlight is right...a 5 gallon tank is really too much for that filter. Look into getting a Whisper Micro to filter that tank...they filter 5 gallon tanks very well, and are very betta safe.

[Rainbowlightning]

Ok, thanks for the advice on cycling the tank...I'll slow down on the water changes and try not to worry so much.
As for the filter, I've just found the reciept, and it's actually Lee's quick & easy filter. I've read that it's good for up to 20g...and at the pet store where I bought it, they said it would be good for up to 10g.
You see I already had a bio wheel filter, but I lost the cover to it. Then I bought a filter ( power filter) but I was told the current would be too strong for a betta, so that's why I bought the small corner filter. I really don't want to have a collection of filters.

Keep testing your water, but don't do another water change until your nitrates read closer to 50ppm

The nitrates read 40ppm ten days ago, dropped down to 30ppm last week and are now at 20ppm. So if the nitrates are dropping, when would you recommend I did the next water change?

Thanks in advance for all of your help. ;D

[twoluvcats]

let the nitrates build back up again (and they will)

[Rainbowlightning]

Ok I'll do that, thanks....
I'll report any changes.

[Rainbowlightning]

Hmmm, ok today the cloudiness has gone... it's just dissapeared over night. I'm hoping that's a good sign.
As for the parameters, I'll test them tomorrow and take it from there.

But I do have a silly question:
I'm still putting a bit of fish food into the tank I'm cycling. How long should I leave it in there? Should I be getting it out with the turkey baster after a while or just leaving it?

[twoluvcats]

leave it...you are going to want to do a 80-90% water change once your tank shows cycled anyway...so you can get it then.

[starlight]

I'm glad to see that the tank isn't cloudy anymore and some of the values are stabilizing. I was at Petco yesterday and looked at the Clear & Free filter that you're using. I think that it is part of the reason why it's taken your tank so long to cycle. The media/carbon cartridge is very small. Regardless of what Lee says, I don't think that it's good for a 5G tank. Here's the rub, when you replace the media bag, what little bio that you have going will be lost (since most of the beneficial bacteria colonize the filter media. I think the Whisper Micro filter that LuvKitties recommended would be an excellent choice for a 5 gallon tank. It filters much more water per hour than the corner filter. It exposes the ben bacteria to much more oxygen than the corner filter does. With the corner filter once you replace the media pack, the tank will go through a mini cycle until it gets up to speed again. Bear in mind that carbon should be replaced every 4 weeks, or it gives back what it has removed from the water.

One way to try to get around it, when you replace the media pack. Swish the old media pack in clean treated water to remove debris. Put the old media bag on the bottom of the tank next to the corner filter. This will help get the new filter up to speed.

ps...I use crushed coral to increase my KH. You can get a media bag or make your own media bag out of pantyhose. (your husband will think that you've flipped) Place the bag of crushed coral near the corner filter and check the KH every other hour until you know how fast it works. Watch the pH closely since prolonged exposure will produce great water for cichlids. Don't let the pH go sky high! One degree more KH should provide enough binder for your 7.0 Buffer to hold it steady.

I'm a great one for projects, huh?

[Rainbowlightning]

LOL, such original ideas! I like it....
A couple of (non priority) questions (that I can get to work on this up coming week):
-Where would I find coral? I'm pretty sure my LPS doesn't have any or I may have noticed it (they have quite a small fish dept).
-Maybe we can come up with a project for one of my already owned filters? (At least until I can invest in a new one...maybe after xmas )
I own this small power filter that sits on the outside of the tank. The only problem with it, as you already know, is the current is too strong for a betta. But maybe if I put something directly under the current, to soften it up... would that work?
It looks very much like the Penguin Mini Bio-Wheel Power Filter (but without the bio wheel).

Any thoughts? Or should I just hang on in there till I can buy a new one?

[starlight]

I use Florida Crushed Coral. It's available at some Petcos. A good fish store will have it, especially if they sell Saltwater Fish. They usually keep it on the bottom shelf near the gravel, it's easy to overlook. Most power filters are too turbulant for bettas. We've had at least one late night fatality on HB as a result of a power filter. They don't just take fins, in this case it caused severe internal injuries. That betta had a sad few hours and the owner felt terrible. Pictures were posted. Not a pretty sight.

Save your money and get the Whisper Micro.

[Rainbowlightning]

Okey dokely....
I'll check for some coral in another pet store nearby.
Although after adding another tiny bit of buffer to my 'standby' bottle, I've noticed both an increase in PH (6.6 right now) AND an increase to the KH (just under 100)...so maybe I'm slowly getting to my target?!

Anyhow, I'm not going to risk inflicting any more danger to Mr Fish, so I'll pass on the power filter (maybe I can sell it in a yard sale?! lol). And I'll invest in the filter you mentioned sometime in the near future (hopefully). It does appear quite compact and nice (just looked it up).

I've noticed how my posts start off with one topic and end in a complete different one, lol, but I was just re-reading your post from before about the filter media.
I haven't changed my filter cartridge at all since I started cycling the tank (what maybe 7 weeks now). Nor have I washed it at all.
Would that also maybe be a cause for the slow cycling process...or is that something I should do once the tank is fully cycled?

[starlight]

The PH buffer appears to be slowly doing it's job. Crushed Coral is sometimes tricky. I had to toss 10 gallons recently that I accidently filtered too long.

for the record...I use Seachem Neutral Regulator; both powdered and liquid form are available at Petco. I use the powder. You might try it after the Proper pH is all used up.

I think the filter catridge has done its job and should be changed. Clean off some of the algae too, it's a byproduct of the rich cycling process. When everything goes well I can cycle a 3 gallon spawn tank in under a week. (5 gallon tank with 6 inches of water.) Unfortunately cycling doesn't always go as planned and I've had some messups along the way. I use my own filters and feed the bacteria but that's another story.

[Rainbowlightning]

Ok then, here's what I 'll do and let's see if I've understood right.
I'll take the old cartride out and place it in the gravel under the filter. And I'll put a new one in.
Does that sound about right?
As for the algae, I'll get my turkey baster on it (decorations) and remove what I can.
There really isn't much, but still, I guess if I just keep on leaving it, it'll only get worse.

[starlight]

Sounds good...monitor the other water params and when the new filter seems to be working (ammo stays at 0, discard the old filter) You are seeding the filter by jump starting it this way.