Food Debate:

[ACKislander]

I'd like to spark up a discussion about Betta food. I've read on the site that you recommend flake or pellet food over bloodworms and brine shrimp.

I'm sure we all agree that bettas need high protein, easily digestible food.

My understanding (and some experience too) is that dried foods such as pellets, flake, and freeze dried food cause bloating, constipation and in worse cases can lead to swim bladder disorders. Many bettas won't even accept the dry foods. Dry foods expand in the bettas very short digestive track where they cause blockage. This is why it is advisable to soak betta pellets for 10 minutes before feeding so that they can absorb water and grow to full size before they eat.

Froze Bloodworms or Daphnia (or in gel) are a great source of nutrition and don't have the same risks involved with the dry food. I've never heard of them causing constipation. (they don't expand in their stomach) I agree that brine shrimp should be used as a treat, but not because of bloating. Brine shrimp don't have the same nutritional benefits as the blood worms, daphnia, mysis shrimp, tubifex worms, etc.

I hadn't heard anything positive about the dried foods before I happened on this site and would like to hear your side of the discussion.

[Rachel - old]

I'm not going to debate because I see positive aspects of both food sources.

One of the main reasons pellets or flakes may be advised is that they are simple, and easy to measure and feed. Specially formulated betta foods often do contain a large source of protein so it would be a viable alternative to frozen/live.

I agree that frozen/live sources are high in nutritional value. These sources may be thought of as a bit more of an inconvenience to some. There is also a correlation of frozen/live food with bacteria or parasites.

Overall, I think the key to a healthy betta is variety in the diet. Solely feeding one type of food may cause nutrient deficiencies or constipation after time. Correct portion sizes are also important as overfeeding of any food may have negative effects.

[ACKislander]

I actually don't feed my bettas ANY dried food. They eat blood worms 4 days a week, baby brine shrimp one day a week, pea one day a week and fast on the 7th day. (haha, it sounds like I have churchy fish) I'm also looking into Mysis shrimp and daphnia, though I haven't bought any yet. Some bettas are unable to digest any or very little dried food at all. I agree that flakes and pellets are convenient to the fish-parent, but I that's a poor reason to strip them of their natural diet. Pellet and flake food in no way replicates what is found in nature. Their GI track is very simply, not designed to digest these foods.

I always recommend, If you want your betta to be his healthiest and happiest, feed him frozen, live or gelled food. I realize that some people buy bettas before they understand what it entails. (little worm on a toothpick) and just can't stand the idea of feeding them meat. It's really too bad for the betta.

There was mention that frozen/live food can house bacterial and parasites. I think you're thinking of freeze-dried, not frozen. Well, yes, some live food can house parasites, but this usually comes from people producing live food themselves. I don't feed live food to my bettas, so I won't comment on it. Freeze-dried blood worms and brine shrimp have been know to cause problems but I have never heard of any issues with frozen or gelled food.

The reason I started this discussion was because I found on healthybetta.com an article entitled "To Feed or Not To Feed" where the following information was given...
"In captivity the betta should be fed betta supplemental pellets (Betta Bio Gold is popular) or a betta flake food. Both provide the proper nutrition your betta needs to grow and live a long and healthy life. Do not feed them blood worms or brine shrimp on a regular basis. These are considered a treat and if fed to regularly can cause constipation."

This information is untrue and unsafe for bettas. I've spent many a night explaining to people online and at the LFS proper betta nutrition and when I read this I fear for the people who don't know better.

I have the nutritional information of Hikari Bio Gold pellets and hikari frozen blood worms if anyone needs it.

Oh, one more thing. I think what you said about portion sizes is THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT thing about betta food. More digestion problems come with overfeeding then any other factor.

really, i'm done

[palepinkvase]

I have a question. Isn't Betta pellets or flakes equivalent to dog or cat kibble?

[ACKislander]

palepinkvase said:

I have a question. Isn't Betta pellets or flakes equivalent to dog or cat kibble?

How do you mean? I'm guessing you might mean that it doesn't emulate their natural diet. Which is true. Pellet food was created as a convenient way for people to feed their fish because some people think worms/shrimp are yucky. It's sad really. In a way it's like saying, your mom thinks meat, veggies and fruits are gross so from now on and for the rest of your life you will only eat grapenuts. Lucky for you, your body can easily digest grapenuts. Bettas can't easily digest the pellets.

[Jenny]

Betta pellets may have been created as a convenience for people, but I do not believe they are bad as you say. It is true that they are not a natural food for bettas, but pet bettas are not 'natural' either. They live differently than wild bettas, and have been bred quite far away from their wild type.

Betta pellets have been specifically made for bettas, with all (or at least most) of the nutrition they need. This is similar to cat and dog food. Cats and dogs can live perfectly healthy lives with a diet of mainly kibble. It is also just fine for them to eat 'natural' food, but this is much more difficult, not because 'natural food is gross', but because there is a whole lot of diet balancing needed to make sure they get the right nutrients in the right proportions. Since most people don't know how much of what type of food they need, it is easier to use kibble. It is the same for bettas. It is my experience, and that of many members here, that bettas can live long healthy lives with just pellets, and the occasional treat of something else in case there is something missing in the pellets. It is overfeeding of any type of food that causes problems, not just pellets.

It may be slightly better for a pet to have natural foods, but only if one really knows what they are doing to give them the right balance. It is certainly not bad for a betta to only feed it pellets, since they are made to give all the nutrition that a betta needs. I do think it is important for bettas to have some variety in their diety, because it is possible that there is something lacking in the pellets that is in natural foods, but not that a diet of mainly pellets is wrong or harmful.

I also don't think that comparing it to feeding a human baby only grapenuts. If the grapenuts were nutritionally all that a human needed to eat, then healthwise this would be perfectly okay. I would only be wrong in that humans are complex beings who crave alot of variety. I do not beleive this is true of bettas. Mine seem quite happy each day as they gobble up their pellets, one of them almost jumping out of her tank each time I feed her. If it is true that bettas want the same variety as humans, then it would be equally true that it is wrong to keep them in the same tank all the time, because a human wouldn't like to be confined to the same house their whole life.

[ACKislander]

I agree with most of what you said.

"Betta pellets may have been created as a convenience for people, but I do not believe they are bad as you say. It is true that they are not a natural food for bettas, but pet bettas are not 'natural' either. They live differently than wild bettas, and have been bred quite far away from their wild type."

This true, they have been captive bred for many generations which is probably why they are more susceptible to parasites then wild Bettas, however it took them many thousands of years to evolve to where they. They may learn to adapt to pellet/flake food eventually but it wont be in our lifetime or even in the life time of our great, great, great grandchildren. Evolution is a painstakingly slow process.

"Betta pellets have been specifically made for bettas, with all (or at least most) of the nutrition they need. This is similar to cat and dog food. Cats and dogs can live perfectly healthy lives with a diet of mainly kibble. It is also just fine for them to eat 'natural' food, but this is much more difficult, not because 'natural food is gross', but because there is a whole lot of diet balancing needed to make sure they get the right nutrients in the right proportions. Since most people don't know how much of what type of food they need, it is easier to use kibble. It is the same for bettas. It is my experience, and that of many members here, that bettas can live long healthy lives with just pellets, and the occasional treat of something else in case there is something missing in the pellets. It is overfeeding of any type of food that causes problems, not just pellets."

I agree about the cat/dog thing. Even my vet doesn't recommend giving your pet homemade food because their nutritional needs are very complex. With a betta, they are less complex and it takes little work to give them what they need nutritionally. As far as Betta pellets being made specifically for Bettas, I disagree. IMO, they were made for people as a convenient/clean way to feed fish. Some bettas can live a long life on pellet food, no doubt. My first betta did. I didn't even realize there was a problem with dry food until my third betta who had terrible reactions to it. Then I started doing research and found out I wasn't alone. Many bettas were having the same reaction as mine, with bloating and constipation and some were even worse off. (Refusing food and developing SBD) I switched and saw the results. Then I sat down and did the math, comparing Hikari Bio-gold (which I favor the most of all pellets) to Hikari frozen bloodworms and the results spoke for themselves.

"It may be slightly better for a pet to have natural foods, but only if one really knows what they are doing to give them the right balance. It is certainly not bad for a betta to only feed it pellets, since they are made to give all the nutrition that a betta needs. I do think it is important for bettas to have some variety in their diety, because it is possible that there is something lacking in the pellets that is in natural foods, but not that a diet of mainly pellets is wrong or harmful."

If your betta, after several months of eating pellet food has not reacted poorly to it, he probably wont. If you're supplementing with other things too, then he's even better off. I definitely don't think it's wrong I just prefer the alternative. Some people are horrified at the idea of keeping worms in the house. And for them, maybe pellets are the answer. The most important thing is, these bettas are being saved from pet stores where they would likely die. If it came down to someone saying, "I'd like to save a betta, but I'll only feed him flakes." By all means, save the betta.

Don't cha just wish Bettas could talk?

[Jenny]

Heh, I think were pretty much on the same page. Both are okay, we just have different preferences. I was not aware that some bettas have bad reactions to pellets. None of mine have, nor have I had any trouble getting them to accept them (beyond the obligatory I don't want for a few days after being brought home). I will keep this in mind and suggest it to members who seem to be having problems with this. Sorry if I came on strong, but I'm a philosophy student, love to argue.

It really would be nice if they could talk. Then you could know exactly what they want, not just genreal rules for keeping them healthy. I can just see it, which plant would you like, the red or the green, and for dinner, no I will not buy you a new hidey, you just got one last week.............

hehehehe

[ACKislander]

Me: Little betta what would like for dinner?
Bone: Chocolate
Me: Oh Boney, you can't have chocolate,it's not good for you.
Bone: Chocolate
Me: you have to eat your worms so you can grow up big and storng.
Bone: I WANT CHOCOLATE!!!!

Maybe it's good betta's can't talk.

[jedicat]

Hehehehehe! Mine would probably ask for chocolate-covered brine shrimp.

I definitely agree that a varied diet is extremely important. Not only does it help to ensure that they're getting a proper balance of nutrients, but it's also good in case they get sick or can't eat or be fed their regular food for whatever reason. Having them already trained to accept many different types of foods is definitely a headache-saver.

I feed my guys a combination of freeze-dried, pellet, frozen, and live foods. I buy live brine shrimp from a fish store about once a month, and so when I do that, for the period of a week, one of their daily feedings is the bs. Gods, they love those little shrimpies. Frozen white mosquito larvae also gets a big "Yum!" rating from them.

I've been slowly decreasing my reliance on pellets as a staple food for them. However, I still keep them around in case I go away, because my housemate who generally feeds them when I'm away, is averse to feeding live, frozen, and fd foods.

Actually, I get far more grossed out when I think about what's in the pellets. As for my $0.02 on the food debate, HBH Betta Bites contain blood meal and feather meal, which are byproducts of the poultry industry. From reading the ingredients of these particular pellets, it appears that the real nutrtional value doesn't come from the actual bulk of the pellet, but from the multivitamins added to it. So in that sense, it is like vitamin- and mineral-enriched cereals meant for humans. Which kinda gets me wondering, if an industry can make multivitamin additives for pellet food, is there, or why isn't there, some type of fish multivitamin that can be mixed in with live foods?

Also, I'm not too comfortable with the idea of preservatives. Ethoxyquin is commonly used as an oxygen-inhibitor in pet foods (including rats, birds, fish, reptiles, and rodents) and when I worked at the animal shelter, we received a lot of faxes from other organisations telling us not to feed it to birds, because high concentrations of it can cause internal damage. I don't know off-hand of any studies done on the effects of long-term high exposure to ethoxyquin on fish, but a lot of people do feed their fish pellets with this preservative, and not everybody's fish are suffering and dying, so it's obviously not 100% toxic. I'm still a little leery, though, but that's the vegan in me speaking.