How often are your fish sick?

[Bettaman]

I simply don't use gravel or any other substrate because I believe it creates a healthier invironment for your fish without any substrate. The whole purpose of the substrate is to create a surface area for the good ammonia eating bacteria to grown on. I have found that using a bio wheel filter provides all the surface area needed to ackomplish this. Also, this good bacteria will also grow on the tank bottom in time without any substrate at all.

Some fish like a substrate to dig into but the type of fish I keep do not and Bettas really have no use for it.

[amanichen]

Bettaman said:

I simply don't use gravel or any other substrate because I believe it creates a healthier invironment for your fish without any substrate.

This argument is used often, and it really doesn't hold any water. Of course when you put substrate into an aquarium, you must maintain it, and not maintaining it is what causes problems.

I could say that I don't use filters on my aquarium because they take forever to get running, and they become clogged and stop working, and then anaerobic bacteria start growing inside of it. Of course when you have a filter, you need to clean it to make sure it works properly.

Of course, a properly maintained filter is useful, as is a properly maintained substrate.

[Bettaman]

To properly maintain the substrate you must periodicaly remove it from the tank and wash it thoroughly. This requires removing the fish from the tank thereby offering an opportunity to stress them out. Of coarse if everything is done perfectly they won't be stressed too bad but I just don't take any chances with my Bettas.

A filter can be properly maintained without removing the fish from the tank.

[amanichen]

Bettaman said:

To properly maintain the substrate you must periodicaly remove it from the tank and wash it thoroughly.

Are you sure about that? Or is that just your experience with gravel? Gravel tends to do that when it's not well maintained -- if maintained well, there shouldn't be much debris in it at all.

Again, like I said, gravel is not the only option for a substrate, and there are MANY OTHER substrates which perform better than gravel in that respect.

You should try to broaden your very narrow window of experience with fishkeeping and realize that gravel is not the be-all, end-all of substrates, and in 3/4 of the tanks it is used, it is NOT the ideal substrate.

[Bettaman]

"You should try to broaden your very narrow window of experience with fishkeeping"


I don't believe you are in any position to define what level of experience I have had with fishkeeping. I worked for a tropical fish importer which exposed me to tons of experience keeping fish. I kept fish throughout my childhood, then later in my 20's, and now again for the last 10 years. I don't claim to be an expert but I am happy to share my observations and experiences with this message board. Readers are free to take it or leave it or discuss it. You don't have to accept what I say but there is no need to attempt to mock my level of experience just because you disagree with my observations and opinions. This is a friendly discussion board not some kind of competition.

You wrongly assume that because I don't like to use a substrate that I have no experience using a substrate. Not true. I have used several substrates and under very well documented situations and I have found them to create more problems than they are worth.

[amanichen]

Other than your claim of having kept bettas for 10 years, you did not provide any other information about your level of experience. I only can say about what I know.

[Bettaman]

Not only have I kept Bettas for 10 years but during those 10 years I have recorded every water change, every water treatment for any reason, every filter and substrate cleaning, every incident of illness, every dose of medicine ever used on any of my fish, the life spans of my Bettas, the pH, KH and GH and temperature of the water in all of my tanks, and any other incidents or interesting observations that may occur with respect to my fishkeeping studies in well documented notebooks. It's amazing the trends you can spot when you keep notes on everything you do.

Keeping Bettas is the most rewarding thing I have ever done just from the love they return to me. So I treat it as a science so that if there is some method, some procedure, some anything that can be learned through careful observation to help my Bettas live a month or two or God willing a year longer, than maybe my serious approach to keeping them will teach me what that something may be. All I seek is the happiest longest living Bettas in the world!

[amanichen]

So I treat it as a science so that if there is some method, some procedure,

I will agree with you on this point. People tend to forget that much of what people know about fish is still based on science =)

[Bettaman]

You'll be happy to know that there is a University doing experiments to try to extend the lifespan of the Betta.
This includes well documented methods of caring for live Bettas and autopsies on Bettas who die from old age.

They have found one thing common in all old age Betta deaths. Excessive fatty tissues around the vital organs. After finding that out, they altered their methods to create test groups with various degrees of daily forced excersize for the Bettas. This study is in progress but initial results are showing increased longitivity with the test group that is excersized the most on a daily basis. So Betta lovers, start chasing your Bettas around their tanks.

[amanichen]

Bettaman said:

You'll be happy to know that there is a University doing experiments to try to extend the lifespan of the Betta.
This includes well documented methods of caring for live Bettas and autopsies on Bettas who die from old age.

They have found one thing common in all old age Betta deaths. Excessive fatty tissues around the vital organs. After finding that out, they altered their methods to create test groups with various degrees of daily forced excersize for the Bettas. This study is in progress but initial results are showing increased longitivity with the test group that is excersized the most on a daily basis. So Betta lovers, start chasing your Bettas around their tanks.

Can you give me specifics on this?

It's well known that fat (especially from land animals) in fish's livers isn't good, and does cause premature death. And yes, most bettas are horribly cramped into small environments.

I was just wondering if you had specifics on this, becuse there are a few rumors going around based on this concept. Every rumor has some bit of truth that started it, so I was wondering if you know the actual study where this took place?

[Bettaman]

I learned about that from a fish expert in California that I sometimes talk to. And he did tell me the name of the Universtity but I don't remember what it was. I'll ask him the next time I talk to him.

[amanichen]

Bettaman said:

I learned about that from a fish expert in California that I sometimes talk to. And he did tell me the name of the Universtity but I don't remember what it was. I'll ask him the next time I talk to him.

Darn. Everybody I hear it from heard it from somebody else. While there's truth behind it, I have yet to find any record of an actual study. This spawned the "9 year old betta" myth.

[Minaku]

Amanichen, what sort of sand and from where would you suggest for substrate usage? (I'm going to try to hit up the fish store tonight to buy meds, and maybe a new fish especially since we're getting a foot of snow tomorrow morning!)

[Bettaman]

This is a real research being conducted and it is NOT a rumor. They don't make any claims to 9 year old Bettas. They are basically working to find reliable methods to extend their life by a few months and maybe up to a year.

[amanichen]

Bettaman said:

This is a real research being conducted and it is NOT a rumor. They don't make any claims to 9 year old Bettas. They are basically working to find reliable methods to extend their life by a few months and maybe up to a year.

How long has it been going on? I first heard stories of such research around three years ago, so has the research been going on for that long?

I'm not saying anybody ever had a 9 year old betta, but variations of this story have been circulating around the internet fro a while, and often they're coupled with stories of an extraordinarily betta. I was just wondering if you had any information on ACTUAL research being done =)